116. The Mayor’s Race: Melissa Cabello Havrda on Community, Accountability, and San Antonio's Next Chapter

Bob Rivard [00:00:03]:
Welcome to Big City, Small Town, the weekly podcast all about San Antonio and the people who make it go and grow. I'm your host, Bob Rivard. Our guest today in the continuing series of candidates seeking to become San Antonio's next mayor is District 6 Councilwoman, Melissa Cabello Havereda. She's a third term council member and a practicing attorney with her own law practice. Councilman, welcome to Big City, Small Town.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:00:27]:
Thank you so much for having me.

Bob Rivard [00:00:29]:
It's a pleasure. Hope it's okay to call you Melissa as we Please.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:00:31]:
Please do.

Bob Rivard [00:00:31]:
Move on with the conversation and introduce you better to our audience. Let's start by telling our viewers and listeners more about yourself and your background and family, education, and and what propelled you into public service even as you've, practiced law, taught community college law students, etcetera?

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:00:51]:
Yes. So I'm born and raised in San Antonio. I'm very proud of that native daughter of of San Antonio. I I grew up in the West Side Of San Antonio. My parents were, grew up in the inner city. My mom went to Fox tech. My father went to Lanier. So the chili bowl was always kind of a tricky situation for us.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:01:05]:
But, I grew up Far West San Antonio. I went to Taft high school. There's the San Antonio question. I'm a Raider. And, very thankful that I had a wonderful public school education. I had parents who invested in me, as far as my education and made sure that I was, going to study. And back then in the nineties, they told you, if you, you have to go to college, you die right now. It's a little different, thankfully.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:01:26]:
But, I was the first person in my family to not only graduate college, but receive a doctorate. I have a JD. And, as you mentioned, currently an attorney. But nothing was ever handed to me. Right. I really had to work very hard for everything. I was a food server in college, bartender. That's how I got through, college.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:01:43]:
It's how I paid the rent and ate. And, I'm really, really grateful for all those experiences because every conversation I had, every table, every time, I had an interaction with somebody, I learned a little bit more about my city. Even being born and raised here, you, you think you know everything about your city and then you, you do something like that or you're in elected office and you realize there's so much more to learn. So, I decided to practice disability law. I feel really strongly about, the special needs community and, and it's something that I had a passion towards. So, I went that route. Before I went to law school though, I worked for Ed Garza when he was both in District 7 and then he was, mayor. And he's now my treasurer and learned a lot about, what a mayor should be as far as leadership, convening people, reaching consensus, that sort of thing.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:02:27]:
And then I went to work for when he was about to term out, I went to work for the San Antonio Parks Foundation under, mayor Emeritus Lila Cockrell. And I really learned a lot about politics. Strangely, I learned a lot about politics working for a nonprofit. Of course I have a passion for parks and green space. And, so that was exciting. And at the time we were working on, we were just starting to work on the Japanese tea garden. So it's really exciting to see everything that's been done with it now. But I learned a lot from Mayor Cockrell about being a woman in politics and I never saw myself running for office.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:03:00]:
But she would always say to me, you know, when you run for office, when you run for office and I would say, Mayor Cockrell, I'm never gonna run for office. Don't worry. But but that that all those experiences together, of course, with school and my law practice, talking to real San Antonians led me to want to go back into politics. And I ran for District 6. Ray Lopez turned out in 2017 and I ran for that seat. There were eight candidates and I made it into a runoff with Greg Brockhouse. And 2017, I lost. And I knew the very next morning I woke up, I was taking all my signs down because I don't like the litter.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:03:33]:
And I, I realized that I really wanted to do this. I really wanted to serve my community. And you learn so much more about losing than you ever do winning. And so I learned a lot about myself. And two years later in 2019, I ran again for District 6. And thankfully, the citizens saw fit to to, elect me. And I've been representing my home district since then.

Bob Rivard [00:03:53]:
Well, I'm thank you for, I didn't know about that connection that you had with mayor Lila Cockrell, and and we miss her. She was a pioneer.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:04:00]:
To us.

Bob Rivard [00:04:01]:
And, people don't realize how how difficult it was in her generation for a woman to get ahead. Yeah. And and, she was the first, woman to lead a city of a million people as a mayor, which is quite a an accomplishment that, we should remember in San Antonio.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:04:19]:
If you indulge me, I'll tell you a quick story about her. Please. Mind. Yeah. So she used to like to go to Shiloh's. Shiloh's, we used to office right next door. So we walked over there to get some soup one day, and she said, Melissa, if you ever run for mayor and, again, I told her, mayor, I'm never gonna run or not mayor. If you ever run for office, I said, I'm never gonna run for office.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:04:37]:
Don't worry. She said, sure. Sure. Sure. If you do though, use your full name. Use Melissa Cabello Hovda. And I was like, of course, I've always used my name professionally. And she said, when I first ran, she ran as missus Sydney Cockrell.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:04:49]:
So she was a council member. And if you look at old buildings where it when they were erected when she was on council, it says Mrs. Sydney Cockrell. So how far we've come, right? So fast forward, to I'm running in 2019 and, I use my full name. Of course, I know it's a mouthful, but she said, I saw her at an event and I went over to her and said, hi, Mary Cockrell. I don't know if you remember me. And she turned quick as a as a rabbit and said, I thought you were never gonna run for office. And I was like, oh my gosh, this woman is genius.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:05:19]:
But she taught me a lot of lessons like that. So

Bob Rivard [00:05:21]:
She told me that when she first ran for mayor, she had to wear white gloves, to all the events because that's how it was expected that women dressed.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:05:29]:
Yeah. Can you imagine?

Bob Rivard [00:05:30]:
And it

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:05:30]:
wasn't that long ago.

Bob Rivard [00:05:32]:
What a different world.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:05:33]:
Yeah. Anyway.

Bob Rivard [00:05:34]:
Well, I wanna ask you about this mayor's race before we go any further because there's 27 people on the ballot. Mhmm. Voters who admittedly in local elections are the best informed voters, and and we were lucky to get 15% of the registered voters to even turn out. But, nevertheless, they're gonna be looking at computer screens with lots of names on them, and they're gonna have to move through those screens to get to, all of the candidates. I'm not sure what number you are.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:06:00]:
I'm number 25.

Bob Rivard [00:06:02]:
So there you go. That

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:06:03]:
Remember the year, 2025. I'm number 25. I

Bob Rivard [00:06:06]:
like the way every candidate is trying to make their number more meaningful.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:06:09]:
You're the whole stink, you know?

Bob Rivard [00:06:10]:
I admire that. But it seems to me that we're acting like a small town, not a big city with this hundred dollar fee. And people talk about accessibility. I frankly don't want somebody that's working poor and struggling to get through in life running for mayor. That's that individual probably does not have the ability to campaign, much less governor or lead. So I'd like to see, that change to where we only have credible candidates running. But I wonder if you agree with that or if you, wanna stick with the current system.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:06:38]:
I don't necessarily wanna stick with the current system. I do think we need a better vetting process. I don't necessarily agree that we should, raise the the price of it. Right? We do want a working class Antonians, to run for office, if they have the capacity to do so. To me, it's more of a civics test. Understand. Do you understand the form of government that we have? Have you been involved? Do you live in in the city? And have you lived here for a certain amount of time? Because right now I think it's something like maybe six months or maybe mayor, it's maybe a year. You have to live here longer to become a municipal judge in in, in the city.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:07:11]:
You have to live here longer to become an employee sometimes. Right? So I do think that the length of time, some engagement, now where those parameters are, I think we'd have to decide that as a community, but I know that there's a number of people running, not just for mayor, but for office that didn't even know the form of government we have. And and that's just, like, kind of jarring to me as as a San Antonian, not as a candidate. Right? And to know that people will vote for them because they see their sign or they like their name or whatever reason. It's it's it's a little frightening, considering how few people do vote, unfortunately, in our city.

Bob Rivard [00:07:45]:
So we have, we have two candidates that are receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars in, political action committee contributions from outside the city and indeed outside the state. You and other candidates, both those on the council and those, running, off the council are limited to $1,000 contributions from individuals or businesses. How do you feel about outside money coming into play such a prominent role in local elections?

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:08:12]:
I think it's, I think it's unfortunate that it's becoming such a a prominent thing. If it was, you know, some money or some support, I understand that. I mean, a a lot of people have connections outside the city. But as somebody who has spent my entire life working, raising my family here in San Antonio, I've spent my civic life here in San Antonio. It's kind of disheartening because I've not been in DC. I've not been in Austin paying attention to other things and developing relationships outside my city. I've been in San Antonio doing the work. So to be sort of punished for it, politically is, is difficult because, you know, you, you, you do good work in your city and you expect people to see that and to understand what you're doing.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:08:50]:
But then when it comes to campaigning, you loan yourself, $300,000 or you've raised $300,000 from DC money or from packs. It seems a little dirty to me, frankly. I do trust San Antonians. I believe that they will see through that, and I just I have to believe in the process, but I'm not going to skirt any rules. I'm not going to try to get this, you know, this, this kind of money that that looks like it's, it's not transparent. And I do pride myself on transparency and accountability. So I think that it's really up to those candidates to explain how they're using that money, where they're getting that money. And more importantly, it's up to San Antonians to ask them that, to understand where it's coming from and why it's coming from those places.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:09:31]:
Doctor

Bob Rivard [00:09:31]:
So as people assess your candidacy, Melissa, how would you, describe yourself as either being similar or dissimilar yourself as either being similar or dissimilar to mayor Ron Nirenberg and his eight years in office and, programs that he has launched, whether you support them in their current form or not, ready to work, the housing bonds, some of the major initiatives under his watch.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:09:51]:
Yeah. I believe, that, that the mayor's heart is always in the right place. I I believe very I mean, wholeheartedly that he believes in San Antonio. He he wants the best for San Antonio. And I think he's makes his decisions based on that love for our city. And that's how we're similar. I will always make decisions based on not just my love for the city, but my, communication with the city. I think that may be where we differ somewhat.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:10:12]:
I very much believe in a public input process and I'm sure he does too, but in practice, it hasn't always happened. Look at our charter review process. The mayor solely came up with the charge for, the charter review commission to review different,

Bob Rivard [00:10:27]:
aspects of the charter.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:10:28]:
Yeah. Aspects of the charter and to figure out what we were going to put on the ballot. He not only that, but he picked the committee. We had no say as council members. And look, it's not me, Melissa, that should have a say all the time. It's me, the representative of a tenth of the city. There's 150,000 people behind me that I represent. So I would have liked for their voice to be heard.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:10:46]:
And I was very vocal about it. I mean, this isn't anything new that I'm saying. And at the end I did bring up, well, can we look at, these other things? Can we look at these other charter review commissions? And my criticism was that not one of these items that was put on the ballot came from the neighborhoods of our city and that's real San Antonians. They had to do with council pay. They had to do with, you know, term limits that I've never ever knocked on a door and somebody says you should have a raise or you should have longer term limits. Maybe, you know, my family, right? But not like nobody else, in, in, in, in San Antonio was worried about that. They're worried about streets and drainage and the things that they see when they look out their front door. And that's what we're obligated to to, to give to them.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:11:26]:
Right? That's our that's our goal. So I think that's where we're similar. I think there's a lot more, public input process even talking about Marvel. Marvel, we, and the arena. I know those are two different things, but they're, they're very much, you know, dovetail into each other. We, I didn't see a big community process. Now you have some people having these big town halls and I think that's great. But we should have started with that.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:11:49]:
We should have said, Hey, we're thinking about this. Let's get community input. Let's have not just town halls, but more importantly, in my book, I don't expect people to come to me. I've got to go to them. So you knock on doors, you make phone calls, you, go to, senior centers, you go to where people are. And that is, I think where we would have done that. I would have done that differently. And not only that, but again, including all the representatives in that conversation.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:12:11]:
A couple of weeks ago, we had to fight to get, the East side representative in and I made that motion. I'm thankful that it passed to get the east side representative and the downtown representative involved in the conversation because they're two they represent the areas that are being, the most directly affected.

Bob Rivard [00:12:27]:
You're referring to, Bexar County Commissioner Tommy Calvert? Or?

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:12:30]:
No. So, we at the city level, we were about to sign, or enter into negotiations for the memorandum of understanding between the city, the county, and the Spurs. Right. And the the person who was representing us was the mayor. The county was county judge. Spurs is it was the Spurs. But I said, hey, we really should have the east side representative, who right now is councilman Miki Rodriguez. And, the District 1, representative doctor Socor, they should be involved in these conversations.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:12:59]:
Their neighborhoods are gonna be directly affected. So that day on the diocese, I made a motion. It passed, thankfully, and they're now involved in those conversations.

Bob Rivard [00:13:07]:
Okay.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:13:07]:
And remember, it's not them. It's their rep the the people that they represent. We had to fight for that. I mean, I don't think that's cool.

Bob Rivard [00:13:15]:
Marvel is the most ambitious, public private partnership that I've seen proposed in my, decades here in San Antonio with a price tag that probably is in the $4,000,000,000 range, and about a billion and a half of that would be the arena. One of the things that has not been, negotiated publicly, obviously, is the the private sector contribution from the Spurs owners, what how much they're willing to invest and, how much taxpayers, whether they're people visiting our city or whether it's people that are living here are going to pay. And I wonder if you have, reached a a sort of, you know, personal, point of, understanding on what you think would be fair.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:13:57]:
I I I think it's at least 50%. I mean, I think that's what a lot of us have been talking about. But to me, I I know that they're looking at the venue tax. The county's looking at the venue tax, and that's a tourism tax, you know, very bluntly, but, the voters have to vote on it. And so in that way, if the county decides to put that up, I'm, I'm at peace with that because the, the San Antonians, bear county, residents will vote on that and know how they're saying that. And I feel very comfortable with that and whichever way they go. Now if they vote, if the County does put up the venue tax on the ballot and the, the, our constituency votes against it, we have to have some very different conversations. But I do believe that this burst should put some skin in the game.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:14:38]:
There are other arenas throughout the, the country where you've seen entirely funded by the entity right there, the ownership. But, I mean, I don't, I don't think it's, it's necessarily, that's the route we have to go, but there has to be some give and take. If we're asking for a venue tax, if we're asking for public dollars that are going to be put into the infrastructure for marble around the arena, then we have to ask them to put in, some skin in the game as well. And, and I, I know that we've seen it time and time again. It happened in my own district. We have Nelson Wolf Stadium and, you know, the missions are gonna move downtown and, there's, there's something like 42 acres around there. So at first I was really upset and I was fighting tooth and nail, like you're not gonna take baseball from, from the West Side. You know, I was really upset.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:15:21]:
And then I realized, you know what, that's just opportunity. They never, all those promises made to the Edgewood area, which is where it is. It's around that area. In District 6 in West San Antonio, they were never kept. There's no economic development around there. There's a few restaurants, but you go to the ball game and then you leave, you go somewhere else. Right? It was never, built in the way that I think we should have built it up. So when I realized they were leaving, I thought, you know what? That's 42 acres.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:15:44]:
I'm gonna make good on that promise. I'd like to see it become like a Brooks campus, like a, a port, you know, something that's an economic generator and, and all including community center, senior center for, for that area. That's opportunity for me. Right? So I think that when we look at the East Side now, we should look at it the same way. There's a lot of designs, a lot of plans right now for the East Side. And I think, I I don't, I don't know that anybody's knocked on a, on a door in, in, on the East Side and really talk to people about what they want to see, but we have to do that. So going now back down to downtown, we have this history of not, fulfilling those promises, right, to the neighborhoods around these, these arenas. And and so I want what I definitely wanna see in the planning is how if you're gonna make this promise to me, just make good on it now.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:16:25]:
It has to start with the development right now, not if you build it, they will come because they won't. We've seen it, even downtown. And I I wanna be real clear. I think every dollar spent on our downtown is an economic generator for the entire city. Absolutely. And I wanna look back in if in ten years, however long it's gonna take, and I wanna see it. I wanna see marble. I wanna see the arena.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:16:43]:
I wanna see it all done really well. I think we are, as the city are on the precipice of, of true, true greatness, real world class city. I believe that in my heart, I'm San Antonio and I'm always going to say we're a great city, but we have, we're just on the cusp of this kind of stepping, stepping up to the next level. And I do believe that marble is a big part of that, but it's all in the execution. So I wanna look back in, in ten years and see it all done, but I wanna make sure that we crossed every t we dotted every I that we talked to every community member we could about housing displacement, about economic development in the area, not just downtown, but on the East Side where we're leaving. And, and all of that has to be the open discussion. It all has to be in the planning process. No kind of, you know, we're gonna build the arena and then we'll figure out economic development later.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:17:29]:
It has to be within that process, the an open process right now. And I think that's how we if we have a real plan, not just, you know, these really nice pictures and a real plan to show. If I'm knocking on a door and talking to miss Martinez on the West Side, hey, this is what this is how we're gonna do it. Maybe she'll understand it and want to do it, you know, maybe not. But at least we have to show that plan. We're not just promised.

Bob Rivard [00:17:51]:
Taking that 42 acres and turning it into a job generation generator like Port San Antonio, which is amazing, the former Kelly Air Force Base or, Brook City Base now or Brook City, I guess, we call it, the former, Air Force Base there. Those require an evangelical kind of mayor in the kind of model of Henry Cisneros that can go out and sell the city and help us compete. We have not had a lot of success competing with Austin and Dallas for all these corporate relocations and expansions that have occurred since the pandemic in the state. And I I wonder if you see the job a little bit differently than, mayor Nirenberg or some of his predecessors in terms of what you would do to be an ambassador for San Antonio out there, advocating for the city in in a in a way that attracts more national attention.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:18:43]:
I think it's absolutely necessary. Again, this time is crucial. I think we're because we're on this cusp of of being a world class city, in a way that we never have been before. I think it's crucial for our next mayor to, to travel and to help other communities understand the great things that all the great things that San Antonio has to offer now. The balance for me is always staying who we are. We always have to stay San Antonio. We can take a lot of ideas from different, municipalities across the world, but they have to be, they have to fit into the San Antonio mold into our culture. And so I, I, that's what I can do as mayor.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:19:17]:
Right? I've, I've, I have traveled to India. I've traveled to Columbia. I've traveled to go sell our city, not just for businesses, but for, airline routes, right? Like direct, direct routes to different cities. And we've been very successful in doing that, but it's, it takes that, that extra kind of I'm from here and let me tell you all the great things about San Antonio. And, and that's what I have. I think that a lot of candidates don't have is, not just in my from here, but I have stayed here and I built my business here and I'm raising my family here. So there's no one better to sell San Antonio. That's somebody that never wanted to leave.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:19:49]:
And there's a lot of reasons why. Right. And I think not, not only my sort of credentials as a native San Antonian, but I bring all the stories of all the people that, that, that moved here, why they moved here. That's my favorite thing to ask, like an Uber driver. It's like, how'd you end up here? You know, I want to know all the, all the reasons And always it's I came here one time or I stayed here for a little while and I just fell in love with the people. Right? I am, I am the people of San Antonio. You are the people of San Antonio. Us going out and selling the city, there's nothing that can replace that.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:20:17]:
And so it's not just, of course we're going to have all the data and the numbers and how you're going to be successful as a business here, but it's a, it's a salesman job, right? Saleswoman job. We have to go in, we have to show really who we are and, and why you should come here because we're going to take care of you. Another big part of that is yes, generate bringing in businesses from other areas of the country in the world, but it also, it means taking care of our small businesses. The success that we have here is no greater selling point to another, business outside of San Antonio then the business is here. If we're showing real success in our small businesses here, then we're gonna attract all those businesses. I do very much believe in staying in San Antonio and keeping your head down and working, but that's what I've been doing for six years as a council person. It's time for me to break out and go and and do that extra, work that that that's required of our mayor.

Bob Rivard [00:21:04]:
One of the, recurring, messages that I hear from small business, Melissa, is how deeply frustrated they are with the public works department of San Antonio and the street improvements projects. And we're we're seeing the city now spend spend untold amounts of money to put a Band Aid on South Alamo for a five day basketball tournament. Yeah. People that have lived through the the Broadway, redevelopment, North Saint Mary's. These are projects that all took sometimes double and triple the time that was predicted, and they're over budget. And that's the case right now with South Alamo. We've had the public works director's resignation, retirement rather, just announced last week.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:21:47]:
Yeah.

Bob Rivard [00:21:47]:
I wonder, what a different approach you would bring to that because it's enormously frustrating and giving small businesses token sums of money doesn't begin to make up for, many of them are actually on the cusp of losing their business because of these projects.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:22:02]:
And they have lost. They're, they we've had a lot of small businesses close because of construction. I'll never forget. It was a few years ago. A gentleman, a restaurateur came to council and just yelled at us. And it was jarring. I was like, woah. I didn't what?

Bob Rivard [00:22:15]:
That must have been Luis Barrios.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:22:16]:
I know. It was, Augie. It was Augie. Okay. Yeah. A famous The barbecue. Yeah. Barbecue.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:22:21]:
And, and I mean, that was kind of the first I'd I'd really understood of it. So I, right away, went into action. I passed, proposed a policy that passed, called a responsible bidder ordinance. And it's, it's kind of like a a pipeline, you know, solution. But it it it happened so much that that it it was really causing a lot of these problems in our city. But when you have a low bid, in our city, if there's a low bid request for proposal, you, you, you bid low and you bid the lowest, hands down, you get the contract. You don't have to have experience. You don't have to be from here.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:22:54]:
There's no other points. It's just low bid. So over and over and over, we were hiring the low bidder and they were doing change orders to raise the price. They weren't responsive to the city. They weren't responsive to the community. They were doing bad work. And then here comes another low bid and they lit, bid low and we hire them again. If you and I needed to do work at our businesses that are our, our homes, and we hired a shoddy contractor, we don't hire them again.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:23:18]:
The city was doing it over and over and over. So my policy proposal was, to, to punish the bad contractors. Right. And I'll tell you, it's funny because the the good contractors were really excited about this because now they could fairly bid. But what happens if you do bad work and it was happening on Old Highway 90 in my district, you do bad work, you take too long, whatever it is, and your the contract is done and you come back and bid, will they assess you? Right? You get put on what's I call the naughty list. So if you're a contractor that has not met this criteria, you don't get to bid for another three years. And after that three years, you have to come back and you have to show how you cured these defects. So we're eliminating these bad contractors that have been doing bad work on, throughout our city, or taking too long or raising the price.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:24:01]:
And so that's again, a pipeline solution. And I, I'd like to think if we'd had that twenty years ago, maybe some of these issues wouldn't be happening. But the more immediate solution is twenty years ago when I worked for Ed Garza, we, we put up the erected, the one stop development center. And that was like innovative because you used to have to run all over the city, all over the different offices, get your permits, to get, you know, everything you need to start a business. And, you had the one stop, right? It was literally one stop. You get everything. That was twenty years ago. We haven't innovated since then.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:24:30]:
Think about the early, you know, February and today getting permits, opening a business, not even always brick and mortar, right? All of this shit stuff should be online. You, it should be forms that you can uniform forms that you're, that are online, that are digital. There's not really a reason to have to go in, maybe for some things, but not everything. And, and not only that, but, hiring inspectors, when you, when you, I guess order an inspection, right, to come look at your facility, you should be able to arrive within a window. You know, frustrating it is when somebody, comes to service something in your home and, they, they don't arrive on it within the window that's happening. So every moment you spend away from your business is another dollar you're out. So we have to be more user friendly as a city. I have a slew of solutions for that, but it really is over overhauling, not just public works, but that one stop development center, just to be user friendly.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:25:19]:
It's just not user friendly anymore.

Bob Rivard [00:25:21]:
I hear in spades from people. It's nice that everything's under one roof, but that the one developer told me the culture there in the city is still, how can we not help you? Yeah. And I care.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:25:31]:
And I wanna be clear. City employees are hard workers and they're the backbone of our city. But when you have, the that culture in an area, it's hard to break that. Right? So I say break it up. I say, let's put it as much as we can online, and and have that kind of one stop be more of a virtual one stop. It's just not who we are anymore. You know, again, this was twenty years ago when we erected this site. It's time for some change there.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:25:55]:
But not just that, but I think we should do like a secret shopper. Like when I was working in restaurants, you used to have a secret shopper and you were like, you know, you, you had to just always be on your game because you could have the secret secret shopper. I think we should do that, with not just a one stop, but other areas of the city, just to, it's not to, to catch anybody in anything. It's just to make sure we're developing and giving the best customer service we can as a city. The city is a business like any other one. And to be successful, we need to be user friendly. We need to be customer friendly. And so I bring in that old kind of, you know, mentality from my early days waiting tables and just how can I help you? And we should be bending over backwards as much as we can, especially businesses coming out of the pandemic.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:26:34]:
They're still very much affected. Construction. I mean, there's our small businesses are in a bad way now. And they also, you know, I want to say that they don't always like being called small businesses because they're they're micro businesses or they're legacy businesses. But we also have to talk about, we I think we do a really good job of helping you start a business, but keeping that business open is a different thing. We can't just kind of, here you go, launch, cut the ribbon, everybody's happy, and then we walk away as a city. We should be there to help mentor you. So even teenage businesses, or they call like second stage, that's I think where we should spend a lot of our time and money and energy.

Bob Rivard [00:27:09]:
Let's talk a little bit about public safety because I think every candidate automatically puts that because it's high on everybody's surveys of public opinion and so forth. But what is your experience in your district informed you as opposed to somebody that's from San Antonio, but but actually, representing constituency. What do you think that we can do that we're not doing, in the realm of public safety?

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:27:32]:
I think we could be a lot more innovative. I do believe that we have to have enough police officers, and we have to make sure they have the equipment that they need to do the work. Absolutely. And we're growing. So, I mean, that number is going to keep increasing. I have no kind of issue with that, but we're not being as innovative as we could be. There's so much rhetoric around policing, especially in the last few years that we spend a lot of time and money and energy on, either, you know, supporting it or some people maybe not supporting it. Right.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:28:00]:
We need to talk about lighting. Bad guys don't want to be seen. It's a very simple concept, but it's, it's data has shown that it's, the national Institute of health did a study that there is lighting as a deterrent. It's a real deterrent. I have, one of those community boxes in in one of my neighborhoods that kept getting broken into over and over and over. So the neighborhoods were calling me. They were really upset about it. The first thing I do is call the postal service and then, you know, not my problem.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:28:24]:
They were living in the HOA. Then I called the state. I'm calling everybody and everybody's doing this. Right? So I was like, alright. You know what I can do? I can put a light post up right next to it. So we did. We put a light post up right next to that community box. And to this day, it's never gotten broken into again.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:28:37]:
It's a it's a real deterrent. And that was a lesson to me. Also, mental health. You know, when the mayor, allocated our ARPA dollars, our COVID dollars to different committees, I chair a public, safety committee and he gave us, 26,000,000 to to spend on public, safety. So every single dollar of that, I shepherded into mental health. Because there was just so much, especially at the time, think about kind of the height of the pandemic there. I'm a disability attorney, right? I fight every day for people with special needs. And the hardest thing to prove is our mental health conditions because they're not visible.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:29:11]:
So there's still very much a stigma. But if you think back to the last few years, a lot of that has lifted. So I think talking about mental health, funding nonprofits that are doing mental health work that has really helped. And, we have the SA core team now and it started off as a pilot program. It was nine in the morning to four in the afternoon, one team. And if you're having a mental health episode, or your neighbor or your loved one, you call call 911, you can, say that they're having a mental health episode. The SA core team would go out, and and they included a police officer because sometimes it could get could get dangerous, but they're they're social work. They're people trained in deescalation, trained to understand the mental illness, and helping not only deescalate the moment, but helping to understand that this is, these are the places that you can, have treatment, you know, show them some resources.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:29:56]:
And then even after that, calling back and saying, Hey, how are you doing? What, how can we help you? And again, it's like we should do with businesses staying in their lives as much as we can. That's going to be a, another deterrent to crime. That's going to stop, you know, maybe even some negative, interactions with, police or city employees. Now if you call and there's a knife or a gun involved, that's different, right? There's going to be a gun in the badge at your door. But this is not front facing. We've grown that now to three, different teams there around the clock. And that's great, but it's still not enough for our entire city. So every dollar spent on mental health, I think, is also a dollar spent on on public safety.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:30:30]:
Well, I see really strongly about that.

Bob Rivard [00:30:32]:
I see those mental health teams working very effectively downtown, particularly with, vagrants and homeless people. Mhmm. And, and approaching those situations with sensitivities. But when you talk to police officers, what they'll tell you, is their frustration is they don't have anywhere to take some of those people other than the jail and which is not where they belong.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:30:54]:
Right. And

Bob Rivard [00:30:55]:
it won't do them any good. Yeah. I'm wondering if you favor, not only a continuation, but maybe an expansion of the housing bond

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:31:03]:
Yes.

Bob Rivard [00:31:03]:
In a way that would create more transitional facilities, more beds for, for for people that, that obviously have addiction issues or mental health issues or both.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:31:13]:
Yes.

Bob Rivard [00:31:14]:
But, we don't wanna incarcerate them.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:31:16]:
Absolutely. I used to, serve on the the Bexar County misdemeanor wheel, which means that I would help, indigent clients, people that couldn't pay for attorneys, in misdemeanor cases. And I would see a lot of times very young people with mental health issues, would get arrested for trespassing on downtown restaurants that would be sleeping in the doorways. And a number of times they had mental health issues that were so transparent. I'm not a doctor. I can't diagnose anybody, but you can tell when somebody's got a real issue. Over and over and over, I was asking the judge for psych evaluations and over and over and over, they were coming up with, you know, they were they were they had diagnosed, impairments. So what would happen is when I would say, okay, well, like, because I care and I'm, you know, I have access to these resources, I'm gonna talk with them about once they get out of jail, let's figure out how to get you into, resources.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:32:05]:
What would happen is the judge would let them go. Once they got the psych evaluation, I never had, there's no way to contact them. And I think about a number of them all the time because I wonder, and one of them, I'll never forget, he was a very young man. I would, it was his eleventh, the rest. He was just going in and out, in and out, in and out. And by the time I, was representing him, he was that's the first time he got a psych evaluation, number one. But then again, they just kind of let him out on the street. I'm not blaming any judge or any in any system really.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:32:30]:
It's just a system that's not set up to support. So we have to have these beds. We have

Bob Rivard [00:32:35]:
to have broken to me.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:32:36]:
Well, yeah. No. It is a broken system. I just can't blame the individual. Right? We have to figure out how to how to fix the system. Right? So a lot of that is we don't have enough mental health beds. We don't have enough care in our community. I mean, I just read yesterday that Center for Healthcare Services, their their funds are going down because of federal cuts.

Bob Rivard [00:32:54]:
Absolutely.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:32:54]:
They are they are number one indigent mental health care provider.

Bob Rivard [00:32:57]:
They're the safety net.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:32:58]:
They're the safety net and they're being cut. That safety net's being cut. And it's terrifying right now. So going back to your question, the the housing bond, I think, is absolutely essential. I'm thankful that our community, sees that housing affordable housing is a real issue. In the six years I've been on council, we do a budget survey every year, and it wasn't until the last two years affordable housing started showing up at the top of those lists. So I'm thankful that the community is behind it. They voted in the last housing bond, and I think one of the big successes has been Town Twin Village.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:33:27]:
I don't know if you've heard of them On East Side. On East Side. Yeah. We have to duplicate that as much as we can all over the city because it's low to no barrier. And yes, people have substance abuse issues. They have mental health impairments. Sometimes they have dogs. And so some places won't take them.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:33:41]:
Right. And we don't wanna separate them from their companion. So a place like Town Twin is, is absolutely essential and key. I'm sorry that it took so long to get there, but that's rapid rehousing. That is literally getting them in a place where they're safe, where they're going to have sustenance and they will, and they're, they're going to have access to care. They're going to have, you know, maybe substance abuse treatment. They're going to have mental health treatment. They can, you know, have a place to support their, their companion animal, whatever it is.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:34:06]:
And, and I'll tell you that I've been to a lot of these encampments and every time I go to one, their communities, they know each other and they're watching out for each other. And, I was a little shocked the first time I went, they were asking like, they know everybody's name, they know where they are. I'm not saying that they're always up to good things, you know, but they do understand and they have a community. So to sort of put them in a place where they're housed and they're safe and they can make their ability and a place to make better choices, we have to support that. So a new housing bond is, is crucial. It's probably going to be the, the last housing bond was really the first one. So we're gonna have to up it. We're gonna have to increase it and try to figure out how to duplicate this model that's been working so well across the city.

Bob Rivard [00:34:46]:
Where do you stand, Melissa, on the conversation about not waiting for the 2027 bond to do that? But, I know that city manager Eric Walsh is looking at a possible earlier election, maybe as soon as November, with a freestanding housing bond.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:35:01]:
I think that's I would love to do that. I think we have to. At this point, we're in a crisis with affordable housing. And now I'm not just talking about our homeless population. Think about people that are getting evicted, they're not yet on the streets, people that, especially young people who are kind of couch surfing, right? Like they're also unhoused, right? Domestic abuse victims. Right. We have so so much, so many people in in in such a population that needs that care and, and help that we should do it as soon as possible.

Bob Rivard [00:35:28]:
If you were mayor, would you support telling all 10 council districts you're all gonna participate in expansion of workforce and affordable housing, and you're not going to, protect your districts against, you know, in support of nimbyism and and saying that only a couple of districts, that are minority dominant populations have to accept, that kind of housing?

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:35:50]:
Absolutely. I mean, that that's a message that and that's the role of the mayor is to to bring people together together to lead them, to convene them. And you will have every district is gonna have nimbyism in one form one form or another. I think a lot of it though is really up to the execution of, we we can talk about developers. Right? Because there have been developers that have done this right. In my district, you don't come in to do anything to open a business, to start a new development before talking to the neighborhoods around you. We sit down at a table. What does the neighborhood want? Don't cut these trees down.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:36:18]:
You know, we don't want a wall here. You know? I had one business that moved in and all the neighbors wanted was like a shrub to, to kind of mitigate some of the sound and the, I mean, it was that, it's that simple. Right. But you have other council members that maybe aren't doing that, or you have developers that are not willing to talk the neighborhoods, and then you start to see that escalate and it's a full thing at council. Right. And it's very public and it's very ugly. But I always, you always have to side with the neighborhoods. And, but just in my world, the reason I've never voted down affordable housing in my district is because I take that time early.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:36:50]:
We're going to make sure that we're all on the same page. We're going to figure out how it works for everybody and we move together as a community. So thankfully I've not had to do that in my own district. But it, of course it happens at other places and showing that leadership as a mayor, look, we have to come up with, this is a policy that we're, operating under. We can't, we have to fight that nimbyism, but the way to fight it is not to come attack it at the end. It's to get that, buy in that input in the very beginning. And sometimes it takes a little longer to do it. But I would rather much rather do it right than do it fast.

Bob Rivard [00:37:21]:
Well, we're we're, we're gonna run out of time, which, is unfortunate because we could just keep going indefinitely, I think. But I wanna ask you about, the 02/2019 climate action and adaptation plan that council passed. And and frankly, it's just sat on the shelf delivering, gathering dust since then. And I wonder, as mayor, would you revisit that plan? Would you like to take it in its current form? We obviously have a tension with the oil and gas industry and with climate change deniers. Mhmm. But one way or the other, it seems to me that we're looking to leadership to say, we've gotta do something for future generations about what's happening. We had seventy two days last year over a hundred degrees in the city. Right.

Bob Rivard [00:38:01]:
Our energy grid's vulnerable. Yeah. We don't have mass transit investment to the degree that we need it in the city. So where do you stand on all that?

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:38:11]:
I think that, San Antonio has long been sort of complacent with climate action because we have, I think, been we felt anyway that we're somewhat insulated from it. We're fine. We have all this great weather. We don't have hurricanes. We don't have, and then winter storm Yuri hits. Right? And then we have the hottest summer in the history of the universe. Right? And we keep having hotter summers and start to I I think we're at that pain point. I I know that a lot of people already understood that.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:38:34]:
We a lot of us saw that coming. We've never denied, you know, that there's climate change happening. But when it's on your front door and and you you see it every day, it's it's it's different. Right? So we, it was one of my first votes, as a matter of fact, in 2019 was the climate action plan. And I remember a former councilwoman, Anna Sandoval, she was the big champion of it. Had a lot of conversations with her to understand it. And my understanding at the time was that we were voting in like a, for me, it was like a analogy of a framework of a house, right? It was, it was a, it's a house that that's been framed and it's up to the council and future generations to, to build the drywall, build, put the floors in, right. Build that house out.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:39:12]:
I don't see that that if you look at that house today, in my analogy, it's still a frame. We don't really have a lot. We spent $30,000,000 on solar, for city build city buildings and that's, that's a huge step forward, but not every city building was ready for it. And in, in due in, in going through that process, I understood that we're not really doing an evaluation of every city facility. So I, as a matter of fact, circulating now, a council consideration request that, would look at every city city facility and how, and let's evaluate that and let's see where are the energy deficits and how can we help them? Because that that's where we have to start, right? With just the city facilities, but we have to get more aggressive about it. And I'll tell you that right now I'm having trouble getting people to sign that CCR because there are outside entities saying, I don't want you to do that to my business. I don't want that to happen in my area. So it's, it's already, it's like a nimbyism in a different way, right? A climate nimbyism.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:40:06]:
And so it's been difficult to sell it. So I think again, as as mayor having that, that influence and bringing the council together, also we're going to have at least, you know, four new council members. Right? This next time around. And I do believe that people at the doors are talking about climate more than they ever were before because of what we're experiencing. So now it's kind of the time. I mean, that kind of, it is the time it's, it's long past the time, but I think this is the iron is hot right now. So, as mayor, that would be one of my priorities is making sure that we are filling out that house, that we're, looking at policies and plans, very aggressive policies and plans to ensure that we as a city anywhere adapting and understanding how to deal with all the climate changes that are happening.

Bob Rivard [00:40:46]:
You know, two years ago, we had Greg Eghhart on the, podcast. He's the senior environmental engineer for SAWS Oh, okay. And and the Edwards Aquifer Authority. And he cited a figure which really has stuck with me, which is in in the summers in San Antonio, Fifty Percent of the water that we're using is being used by, people and businesses with automatic irrigation systems Mhmm. That are watering non native turf and landscapes. And that, we literally could reduce our water consumption by 50% if we would follow, in the tracks of Albuquerque and Las Vegas and other Southwestern cities and say, you've got to have native landscaping. Yeah. We're now approaching the possibility of the drought becoming a record drought.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:41:32]:
Mhmm.

Bob Rivard [00:41:33]:
It's been six years running. We're on the edge of our seats about wildfires, particularly in the Texas Hill Country and and around the city. And, the city council has hesitated in the past to touch that as, oh, we don't wanna upset the neighborhood associations on the North Side and Northwest Side. Yeah. But, they're using half of our water, and people that live in the inner cities who are minority dominant, they're paying for that.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:41:58]:
Yeah. Absolutely. So I'm not afraid of it. I introduced a a policy a while back to, allow h a lot of h two a's won't allow,

Bob Rivard [00:42:07]:
native landscaping, which is ridiculous.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:42:09]:
Right. Zero xeriscaping or, you know, all of that. Right? And I actually did holidays. I did learn this, on a trip to, it was Albuquerque or Santa Fe. But they all these beautiful landscapes that that have native plants, not a lot of grass. And I mean, they're gorgeous. Right? I think that HOA's were thinking, well, they're just gonna put a, you know, a yard of rocks and call it a day. Right? So I understand that we we all want our neighborhoods to look beautiful, but we also want drink water.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:42:33]:
We want clean water. We want safe water, and we have a water problem. We we have enough water now, but we don't know that we're gonna have enough in the future. And so we have to be good stewards of that. And so I introduced this policy and I'll never forget it was an m u it was a municipal utilities, commission, meeting. And, the, Robert Huente, who I think is a good, good guy, I asked him, hey, if, if we could get remove these, or supersede HOA restrictions on xeriscaping and, and native landscaping, would that save water? And he said, no. And it was like, like jarring. I mean, it, it kind of took the wind out of my sails.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:43:07]:
Right. But I started talking more to other people about it. I'm not an expert on it, so I didn't have a whole lot to say back, but I, you know, I'll just say I didn't buy it. Right. So I started talking to people understand that that couldn't be a real game changer. I'm not afraid of, of any HOA. My own HOA won't allow it. And that's really how I learned it because there was a, an individual who did it and was told you got to get rid of it.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:43:30]:
So anyway, I mean, going back to the fact that You're a

Bob Rivard [00:43:32]:
lawyer, someone needs to sue those HOAs.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:43:35]:
Right. Yeah. Well, I don't think we need to, I mean, I don't wanna go that route necessarily, but we we do need to change our city ordinances that that will supersede an HOA covenant. You know, you're not allowed to do that. I mean, it may end up in a lawsuit. I don't wanna do that, but, you know, we gotta fight for what's right in our community and that's right for our community. Making sure that we have, good, safe, clean water. We have enough water.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:43:54]:
We're saving it as much as we can. And again, those can be really beautiful landscapes. And look as a homeowner, like I would love not to have to worry about my dead grass. I mean, I don't, I don't water at all because I don't wanna, you know, hurt our water or lower our aquifer any, but, but I don't want a dead grass lawn either. Right? I would love to have beautiful native, landscape. And I think most homeowners would like to do that, but they have to follow their HOA covenants. Right. They don't want their home being taken by, by a neighborhood association.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:44:23]:
So I think it's important. I think it's, it's, not as innovative as I think people think, but, sometimes for some communities it is. And so we just have to fight that, that, stigma, I guess.

Bob Rivard [00:44:34]:
Well, conserving and managing our our water as we, add another million people to

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:44:39]:
the Yes. Mhmm.

Bob Rivard [00:44:40]:
To the, city population over the next couple of decades is a is a, critical issue and a good place to stop. So thank you so much, councilwoman, for coming on to Big City, Small Town.

Melissa Cabello Havrda [00:44:49]:
I enjoyed it. Thank you very much. Appreciate you.

Bob Rivard [00:44:54]:
Please share this episode with friends and colleagues, and do sign up for Monday Musings, our weekly newsletter at bigcitysmalltown.com. Big City Small Town is brought to you by Western Urban, building the city our children want to call home and geek them where startups are born and smart ideas become businesses. Our producer is Corey Eames, video by Erica Rempel, and sound engineering by Alfie de la Garza of Sound Crane Audio. We will see you next week.