104. Inside UTSA Honors College: A Different Kind of Higher Education

[00:00:00] Bob Rivard: Welcome to big city, small town, the weekly podcast, all about San Antonio and the people who make it go and grow. I'm your host, Bob Rivard. This week's guests come from the university of Texas at San Antonio and the honors college. Dr. Jill Fleurier is vice provost for honors education and professor of anthropology.

[00:00:22] Bob Rivard: Her undergraduate degree in anthropology is from Harvard college. And she holds both a PhD and an MA in anthropology from Stanford University. Dr. Fleurier has roots in South Texas, having grown up in Harlingen in the Rio Grande Valley, and comes from a family with a long history of professional and volunteer service.

[00:00:43] Bob Rivard: Dr. Fleury, welcome to Big City Small Town. 

[00:00:45] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So delighted to be here. Thank you. 

[00:00:47] Bob Rivard: And you have with you two wonderful students from the Honors College, Brandon Aviato. 

[00:00:52] Brandon Aviado: Yes. 

[00:00:52] Bob Rivard: Brandon, welcome. 

[00:00:53] Brandon Aviado: Thank you. 

[00:00:54] Bob Rivard: And Vicki Kidder. Vicki, welcome to you too. 

[00:00:56] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, thanks for having me. 

[00:00:58] Bob Rivard: Glad to have all three of you on. We've never [00:01:00] had three people on the Big City Small Town podcast, so you're making history for us.

[00:01:05] Bob Rivard: Jill, why don't we start with you? I don't think a lot of our audience members are aware that UTSA has an honors college and that the academic rigor that is brought to that is an option that people whose children are looking at the leading public universities in Texas should be looking at and the possibility of attending UTSA and, and the honors college.

[00:01:28] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: The best way to think about an honors college at a place like UTSA is a small liberal arts college nestled within all of the resources and supports of a research intensive public university in the city of San Antonio. And honors colleges provide intensive and intentional community curriculum, financial support, and academic coaching for students who are curious, committed, and accomplished.

[00:01:54] Bob Rivard: Well, one thing that's attracted me to it is the option for experiential learning. Would you talk about what that [00:02:00] is and what that means for? For students. 

[00:02:02] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And this is where I get so excited about our curriculum. I should mention at the outset that we have about 2, 600 students and we're growing. So we want to be 1 in 10 undergraduate students.

[00:02:12] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: We have that kind of talent, it abounds in our undergraduate population and it's a matter of reaching them and, and bringing them into the fold of the Honors College. So experiential learning, what does that mean? It's a buzzword in education these days. For me it means you learn, you apply or do. You reflect, and then you repeat, and you do it over and over again.

[00:02:32] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So, for example, Bob, what was your favorite class in college and why? 

[00:02:36] Bob Rivard: Oh, that's hard to say, but it would probably be, um, the professor is no longer at UTSA, but, uh, he, he is the person that, uh, sensitized me to the internal colonization of the Mexican American population in 20th century Texas, South Texas.

[00:02:53] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And why did that resonate? 

[00:02:55] Bob Rivard: Because I thought I knew my Texas history and [00:03:00] politics and culture and I realized how little I knew and how much I was able to learn from, from him. 

[00:03:06] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And you were able to connect it with your experience in the Valley as a journalist, I would expect as well. I was 

[00:03:10] Bob Rivard: and I was able to apply it as my, um, in my work as the, at the time as the executive editor at the Express News.

[00:03:16] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Perfect example of experiential learning. You're learning something, you're applying, you're thinking it through, and then you're doing it over and over again. We know from all the educational research that that takes you from surface learning down to deep learning and the stuff sticks and it makes you engage with your community.

[00:03:31] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And so we have a curriculum that where students don't do just one of those, they do six of them. And then if you want to graduate with distinction, you do even more than that. So what we do is we take each individual student figure out what their professional, civic, social, personal goals are, and then we give them the resources and the coaching, the courses, the out of classroom experiences, and the funding to be able to achieve those.

[00:03:55] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: They end up doing six of those what we call experiences in the Honors College. 

[00:03:59] Bob Rivard: How do [00:04:00] students get in? 

[00:04:01] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: We have multiple pathways because we want it to be accessible. A very real critique of Honors Colleges in the past is that they were elitist, and most Honors Colleges today will say, we are elite, but we're not elitist.

[00:04:13] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So there's the traditional first year you are admitted to UTSA, you get the Distinguished Presidential Scholarship, and that automatically gives you an invitation to the Honors College. If you're a transfer student and you get the Distinguished Transfer Scholarship, automatically invited. But then we also have students who may not.

[00:04:28] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Turn on intellectually or academically or have the resources to until later. So each semester, a student earns a 3. 5 or higher. They're invited to join honors. And then we have program on ramps too. So students who are really top notch in one area, they go really, really deep and they're just extraordinary.

[00:04:46] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: We want to be able to accommodate and make it accessible for them as well. 

[00:04:49] Bob Rivard: So this isn't necessarily a matter of someone's high school transcript or their SAT score. and getting in. 

[00:04:56] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Correct. That is a traditional way, but we also know, [00:05:00] um, in addition to people clicking at different times, um, that people have different ways of expressing accomplishment.

[00:05:06] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And we want to be able to recognize all of those. 

[00:05:09] Bob Rivard: So let's turn to a couple students in the Honors College and hear about your path to, uh, to coming to San Antonio and, and to the school. Brandon, we'll start with you. 

[00:05:19] Brandon Aviado: So my education journey, I'm a non traditional student. So I didn't. Come to you to say until I was this year and I'm 30.

[00:05:26] Brandon Aviado: Um, prior to that, I was actually born and raised in Seattle, Washington. I didn't do super well in my public school experience and not exactly because the public school, but just because I think I wasn't obviously wasn't mature. I didn't really value education as much. And when I left high school, I went into a vocational degree towards medical assisting from there.

[00:05:46] Brandon Aviado: I joined the military I was an army medic for six years. Um, and it was after doing all that, that I kind of realized the importance of, of going to college, of having. Um, even if the certificate is just a signal to employers, which I don't believe it is. But [00:06:00] even if that's all it was, it's still in our reality important, right?

[00:06:03] Brandon Aviado: Uh, so after that, I did a little construction, went back to school for a bit. Can I 

[00:06:08] Bob Rivard: ask, did you come to Fort Sam? 

[00:06:10] Brandon Aviado: So I, I didn't. I was an Army medic, so I was training here. Uh, I actually came here again a couple times during my, uh, my time in the military. And I'm here now because my wife is stationed here.

[00:06:20] Brandon Aviado: She's, uh, current military. So, I'm not gonna say I'm basically a San Antonio man, but I've been here a couple times now. 

[00:06:25] Bob Rivard: And, and what, what, uh, propelled you into the Honors College as opposed to just being a, uh, student at UTSA? 

[00:06:31] Brandon Aviado: So when I was in the military, I, I was, uh, attached to the Airborne Infantry as a medic.

[00:06:36] Brandon Aviado: And the Airborne is kind of a heightened experience in the military. You're not just, and I, I don't say just a soldier, but you're not just Uh, Soldier, you're, you're doing high op tempo missions, so I, I was in another country every, you know, two to three months, you're always on call during certain parts of the year, it's, it's an intense experience.

[00:06:54] Brandon Aviado: And it kind of built this sense of, you know, I want that with everything else I do. And so, it was nice to have [00:07:00] that here at UTSA because it gave me that heightened level of what you said where it's, we're elite but we're not elitist. 

[00:07:06] Bob Rivard: It sounds like the military gave you purpose in life. 

[00:07:09] Brandon Aviado: They did, yeah. I mean, especially Considering how I was not doing so great in school before that.

[00:07:13] Brandon Aviado: And, 

[00:07:13] Bob Rivard: and, um, Brandon, I asked you before we got on, uh, on camera about your last name Aviado, which I had not heard before. And you told me that it was Filipino. Yes. And are your parents from the 

[00:07:25] Brandon Aviado: Philippines? So, uh, my grandparents on my mom's side are from the Philippines, but I'm actually part Mexican as well.

[00:07:30] Brandon Aviado: I'm half and half. And my grandfather's actually from RGV, and my grandmother's from Corila. 

[00:07:35] Bob Rivard: Well, you're in exactly the right city, my man. 

[00:07:37] Brandon Aviado: Yes. 

[00:07:38] Bob Rivard: Uh, do you have, uh, uh, people in your family that have graduated from college, or are you first generation? 

[00:07:45] Brandon Aviado: On my mom's side, I do. Uh, not so much on my dad's side, but on my mom's side.

[00:07:48] Brandon Aviado: My mom got her MBA from UW Fosters when I was around 10, 11. And my grandfather had a degree in engineering from Seattle U. 

[00:07:57] Bob Rivard: And what's your major, and where do you hope to [00:08:00] go 

[00:08:00] Brandon Aviado: from here after you graduate? It's kind of a loaded question, but uh, It's economics is my major. I'm still not 100 percent sure where I want to go.

[00:08:07] Brandon Aviado: I spent most of my time in medicine, and then I decided to pivot after some experiences I had in college. Um, positive experiences. And, uh, I'm still unsure yet of what that's going to be, whether that's public or private. 

[00:08:18] Bob Rivard: All right, Vicky, tell us a little bit about yourself. 

[00:08:21] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, so I'm Vicky. Um, this is my last semester at UTSA.

[00:08:25] Victoria Kidder: I've been a student here for eight semesters. My journey to UTSA was a little bumpy. I am a traditional, you know, first year admit. I've been here for four years. But, so I grew up in Rockville, Maryland. And, you know, I kind of always thought that I would attend the University of Maryland, but the system that sent my transcript to Maryland actually didn't send it by the early action deadline, and I didn't know, um, so I was disqualified from any financial aid, I was disqualified from joining their [00:09:00] honors college or any special programs, And kind of being in not an elitist, but kind of an elite group was important to me coming out of high school because in high school I was in the magnet program, which was just a smaller group of students who took a bit more rigorous courses, and I wanted a community like that in college.

[00:09:19] Victoria Kidder: So being in an honors college was really important to me. But also going to college at an affordable price was something that was, you know, top priority for me. So I started to do research and I figured out that Texas has a law where if you get a certain amount of scholarship from a public institution, they'll grant you in state tuition.

[00:09:42] Victoria Kidder: You know, for that year, 

[00:09:43] Bob Rivard: you just taught me something. I didn't know that. 

[00:09:46] Victoria Kidder: I like 

[00:09:46] Bob Rivard: your research skills. 

[00:09:48] Victoria Kidder: Yeah. And I was like, Oh, like, it seems like Texas is the only state that does this. And then I discovered UTSA is distinguished presidential scholarship, which is a renewable for your scholarship. And if you get [00:10:00] over 1000 a year, then, you know, they'll give you an in state tuition waiver.

[00:10:05] Victoria Kidder: So, you know, I applied to UTSA. Um, luckily I got the Distinguished Presidential Scholarship. I got in state tuition, making college really affordable for me. And I got automatically admitted into the Honors College. So I was like, great, you know, it's also in a city. I have, you know, a great scholarship going for me.

[00:10:22] Victoria Kidder: I'm in the Honors College. So, you know, UTSA set me right up for success when I thought at one point I wasn't even going to go to a four year college. 

[00:10:32] Bob Rivard: Wow, that's a terrific story. And here you are in your last semester on the cusp of graduation. What comes next? 

[00:10:40] Victoria Kidder: Well, I, I'm a double major. So I finished my political science degree up last semester.

[00:10:45] Victoria Kidder: Oh, we have 

[00:10:45] Bob Rivard: that in common. 

[00:10:46] Victoria Kidder: Yeah. And I'm finishing up my economics degree this semester. Um, I do want to attend law school. And then after law school, specialize in some intersection of law and economic policy. But I do want to take a [00:11:00] gap year because that's that's coming. That's becoming more common for people that want to go to law school.

[00:11:05] Victoria Kidder: K through JD is not really the thing anymore. It's more so taking one to two gap years and working and then, you know, going to law school. So I either want to spend a year working in Austin or I applied for the Fulbright scholarship. Another great thing about UTSA is that they have an office of nationally competitive awards where there's people there that specialize in helping you winning huge scholarships.

[00:11:30] Victoria Kidder: So, I applied for the Fulbright Scholarship to be an English teaching assistant in Vietnam. Um, I'm currently going through the interview process, but UTSA has also been super helpful in, in setting me up for that for, for my gap year. 

[00:11:43] Bob Rivard: Oh, congratulations. So, your gap year could be a year living abroad as a Fulbright Scholar.

[00:11:48] Victoria Kidder: Yeah. 

[00:11:49] Bob Rivard: When will you find out? 

[00:11:50] Victoria Kidder: Um, my interview is in March, and then Uh, I think I'll find out probably early April. 

[00:11:56] Bob Rivard: Well, I want to be sure that you tell us so I can tell people in our [00:12:00] Monday Musings newsletter that a guest was a successful applicant for a Fulbright scholarship. 

[00:12:08] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, I'll definitely let you know.

[00:12:09] Bob Rivard: I wonder if both of you have had intern opportunities or not. We had an intern from the Honors College here at Big City Small Town a couple of years ago who was a wonderful addition to the team. Right when we were starting out. And, uh, I've always been impressed with everybody that I've met out there at the college that are, that are in the program in the school.

[00:12:29] Bob Rivard: Um, have you, had you had some work opportunities that are related to either your own career paths or your interests? 

[00:12:39] Victoria Kidder: Uh, sure. So I've had an internship or some kind of job pretty much for every semester I've been in college. Uh, my first semester I went on the UTSA website for Handshake and um, 

[00:12:55] Bob Rivard: what's Handshake?

[00:12:56] Victoria Kidder: It's kind of a site where you can, it's like a localized [00:13:00] site for a bunch of career opportunities. So it's like Indeed, I'd say, but it's geared towards UTSA students. Um, and you put, you know, your major and your interest in and they can match you up with different internships or jobs that you're interested in.

[00:13:14] Victoria Kidder: So I found a particular a position, um, as an intern for a city councilwoman through that. My first semester at UTSA, like, I moved in and then right after that I got the internship through Handshake. 

[00:13:26] Bob Rivard: Who with? 

[00:13:27] Victoria Kidder: Uh, Ana Sandoval. She's no longer a councilwoman, but that was a really great experience. She was 

[00:13:32] Bob Rivard: a very high profile councilwoman in her day.

[00:13:34] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, and she was so nice and she was amazing to work with and I got more exposed to the San Antonio community that way, but I wanted a bit more, you know, state experience, federal experience because, you know, I do want to work in the public sector, um, with the government after law school. So UTSA has this thing called legislative fellows, and they basically send a select cohort of students [00:14:00] to, um, Austin to live in Austin full time, work at the legislature full time as an intern.

[00:14:06] Victoria Kidder: So, um, I did that during the 88th legislative session 

[00:14:11] Bob Rivard: 2023. 

[00:14:12] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, um, I interned for the Texas Senate Finance Committee. And that was amazing as an economics major and my rent was fully paid for. I didn't have any financial stress because UTSA fully covered me financially. That's 

[00:14:26] Bob Rivard: amazing. 

[00:14:27] Victoria Kidder: Yeah. And I mean, if I didn't have that financial support, I probably couldn't have done that.

[00:14:32] Victoria Kidder: But luckily I was able to go there and not worry about finances and fully immerse myself in the experience. And UTSA's government relations team helped connect me with my office. One that, you know, really. ties into my interest as an economics major. And then the year after that, I kind of pivoted towards the federal government.

[00:14:52] Victoria Kidder: So the UT system has a program called the Archer Fellowship Program, and that's basically the Austin program, but in [00:15:00] Washington, D. C. So, you know, I applied for that and luckily I got in and once again, UTSA paid for my tuition, my rent, everything was, they even cover the plane ticket. Everything was fully paid for, so I could go to Washington DC and fully immerse myself in the experience.

[00:15:17] Victoria Kidder: And through that, through, um, you know, guidance from UTSA and the UT system staff, um, I interned at the White House for a semester with their Council of Economic Advisors. So through the Honors College, you know, I've received a lot of support, a lot of great experiential learning opportunities. And honestly, being in the Honors College has changed my life.

[00:15:39] Victoria Kidder: I have so many new connections, so many more experiences than I could have ever hoped for coming into UTSA as an undergrad. So, you know, if you're interested in maybe interning for the White House one day, I would definitely go the Honors route. 

[00:15:52] Bob Rivard: What an incredible, uh, opportunity you've had over the space of four years here.

[00:15:58] Bob Rivard: How about you? Yeah, 

[00:15:59] Brandon Aviado: so I'm actually [00:16:00] currently right now doing two internships, uh, one with Yahoo on their business development and partnerships team and the other with, um, it's kind of a research internship that was kind of created uniquely from an experience I had with the honors college. Last semester, we did a mini competition where you and a team of people compete against other teams within the honors ecosystem to find a solution for a problem for last semester.

[00:16:24] Brandon Aviado: I think it was the first time I did this. It was. understanding the issue for affordable housing with housing insurance with rising housing insurance costs and generating a solution that could kind of answer that. My team didn't win unfortunately, but the solution that we came up with and my professionalism while working with the client they had was impress the client and so he basically created an internship for us to continue the project and actually develop the solution.

[00:16:51] Brandon Aviado: And that's purely from the experience that honor college honor college honors college gave us. Coupled with an agent center, which is, I don't know if you know what the agent center is. And you can [00:17:00] probably absolutely. There you go. 

[00:17:01] Bob Rivard: Yeah. Harvey and agent is a household name in this city. 

[00:17:04] Brandon Aviado: Yeah, makes sense.

[00:17:05] Bob Rivard: Generous philanthropists out there and made his fortune in computers and technology and has been giving back ever since. 

[00:17:13] Brandon Aviado: And I will say with an agent center that wasn't the only program they offered. They offered there were, I want to say, at least four other programs they're doing the same time, whether you're a a budding entrepreneur, or somebody looking to do research prior to a graduate program.

[00:17:27] Brandon Aviado: Um, so that's how I got the, the unique internship. For the Yahoo internship, that was also UTSA experience, although it was a little separate from Honors College. It was with the Business Honors Program. Um, they're not exactly Honors College, but I think they work together on a lot of things. And, uh, what Business Honors does is they will bring in prospective employers to come talk to the Business Honors students.

[00:17:48] Brandon Aviado: Probably like every week at the Alvarez College of Business. Yes. Yeah. And so, um, I got to meet with one of the high level VPs over at Yahoo. And he came in to talk. 

[00:17:57] Bob Rivard: That's remarkable. It 

[00:17:58] Brandon Aviado: was really cool. And, uh, it was [00:18:00] purely for me pulling him aside and say, Hey, I, you talked about something that your team does.

[00:18:04] Brandon Aviado: I think it's really cool. Is there any way we can connect? And with that, I built a mentorship mentee relationship and then asked him if there was, um, space on his team for an internship, and they also created an internship position just because of that experience, so, uh, it's, it's kind of crazy the opportunities that came up, and that was my first semester at UTSA, uh, kind of crazy the opportunities that came up, and, um, I also will say, you know, I'm getting college credit for both of these internships, so I'm not missing out on any part of my education to do these things, and I think that's, that's absolutely amazing, especially for a non traditional student.

[00:18:35] Brandon Aviado: I Who needs to get a job while also balancing the, you know, getting the degree. Uh, that was something that I, I'm definitely thankful for. 

[00:18:43] Bob Rivard: Jill, these are incredible, uh, you know, narratives. I, I consider myself a supporter of the Honors College, but I don't think I've had a full appreciation of the opportunities people are getting there.

[00:18:55] Bob Rivard: And, and, um, I just wonder how much our community [00:19:00] understands what's available at UTSA and the Honors College. Cause I know the tradition is always. People in high school that are high performing students are looking at UT Austin or they're looking at A& M and Corp in College Station and maybe Texas Tech and Lubbock.

[00:19:13] Bob Rivard: But, uh, right here at home, these are, these are remarkable pathways for, for students to consider. 

[00:19:20] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: I entirely agree. I think that the narrative has been changing for some time, and I think the integration is going to help a lot with that. I think students are going to be drawn to UTSA in ways that they have not.

[00:19:33] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: necessarily been in the past, but I also think it's about the visibility of the students like Brandon and like Vicki and there there are many, many more. Um, and it's telling their story because I think that's what is most compelling. One thing I wanted to follow up on is they both mentioned honors programs.

[00:19:49] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So most of our colleges have an honors program that allows students to go deep within their major and the other colleges are developing them with the honors college. So when you're a student in the [00:20:00] honors college, you're not only in the honors college, you're also in your major college, 

[00:20:04] Bob Rivard: right? 

[00:20:05] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And so that allows you, if you don't, you don't have to be in your college honors program, but if you want to go deep into your major, that's the way to do it.

[00:20:11] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And then half, half of your honors college requirements are fulfilled by participating in that. And then when Vicki was talking about the legislative fellows in the Archer Fellowship programs being fully funded. That's something that the Honors College also worked in partnership with the other colleges and said, How can we make money not an issue for students so they're not losing wages?

[00:20:31] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Are they can make up for lost wages and and All of the extra expense that spending a summer in Austin, excuse me, a semester in Austin and a semester in DC do. And so all of the colleges got together. And so while the Honors College runs those programs, it's in partnership with all of the other academic colleges at UTSA too.

[00:20:47] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And that that's emblematic of how UTSA works. How can we leverage all of our resources together in order to benefit students? 

[00:20:55] Bob Rivard: Yeah, I think the financial aspect of this is really important in both of you and your [00:21:00] In your remarks mentioned different scholarships and financial assistance that's made possible what otherwise wouldn't have been possible.

[00:21:09] Bob Rivard: I don't know your family circumstances, but will both of you graduate with relatively little debt or will you have high debt? 

[00:21:18] Brandon Aviado: No debt. 

[00:21:19] Bob Rivard: No debt. 

[00:21:20] Brandon Aviado: No debt as well. I'm not, I'm not even using my military benefits for my time here. So no debt. 

[00:21:25] Bob Rivard: I hope people are listening carefully to that who have college age students about to get out of high school and, and going because it's, it's, it's remarkable how the institutions are pivoting.

[00:21:36] Bob Rivard: To give qualified students the opportunity to attend school, not to have to drop out to work and raise money, but more importantly, not to graduate with really burdensome levels of debt. 

[00:21:50] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: I agree. And, and I've got one thing to say, but then I want to also turn it back over to Brandon because Brandon came from Alamo colleges as well.

[00:21:56] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: That's part of his story, too. 

[00:21:57] Brandon Aviado: So I came from Alamo colleges. I got [00:22:00] my associates in biological sciences from there. Last year, I graduated from there. And, uh, I will say, you know, I think a lot of people, when they first start out college, or when their, you know, kid is going to go to college, you think of the pinnacle of college, right?

[00:22:13] Brandon Aviado: Like, you have to go to these top tier schools in order to get a quality education, and the investment's always going to be worth it. But I think, as we all know, that's not always the case, right? Um, there was, I don't remember which article or which newspaper published it, but the, uh, the value for college for, especially for minorities, uh, I think it's when they measure the wealth, what's it, the wealth disparity, um, the value for college is not as apparent as it used to be.

[00:22:40] Brandon Aviado: Um, and it levels out when you're going to a state school or community college to kind of bridge that, that cost, but. Um, as I said in the beginning, sometimes college is just, and not for you to say it, but is just a signal to employers that I've done what I need to do to be considered employable. Um, you don't need to pay, you know, [00:23:00] 70, a year to do that, right?

[00:23:02] Brandon Aviado: You can, you can go to a state school and clearly have these solid experiences. Um, and I'll, I'll go into the experiences I had in Alamo because I was surprised what a community college could offer as well. But you could have these amazing experiences and be incredibly competitive both from a academic but also a experiential standpoint without paying top dollar to go.

[00:23:21] Brandon Aviado: To, you know, one of few prestige positions at like Harvard. 

[00:23:26] Bob Rivard: And did you receive your associate's degree from the Alamo colleges without incurring debt? 

[00:23:32] Brandon Aviado: Yes. Yeah. I did use my education benefits at first, but then I realized it was so cheap. I didn't have to do that. And so, yes, no debt incurred from Alamo colleges.

[00:23:41] Brandon Aviado: Um, from San Antonio College. Specifically, 

[00:23:44] Bob Rivard: Jill, do you have to engage in development in fundraising? And do you have somebody in the Honors College that does that on behalf of the Honors College? How does that? How does that work? And I know even within UTSA, there must be. Competing interests for scarce [00:24:00] resources because there isn't any organization, right?

[00:24:03] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Right. Lots to unpack there. Yes. So I definitely do development work and I do it in conjunction with my chief development officer, Corey Cowart. Um, and what it really is about, though, is getting out in the community and telling the story about The honors college and the students that we serve within it.

[00:24:20] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: One of the great things about being in the honors college is that we are not in competition with other colleges because all of their students are also our students. I mentioned partnerships earlier and we have partnerships across all of our colleges for pathways and honors. So the College of Liberal and Fine Arts, for example, is not development related, but it's recruitment related.

[00:24:40] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Um, Glenn Martinez, who's the dean identified schools. An ISDs along the border that have incredible AP Spanish students. Um, and we worked together to find on ramps for those students to both UTSA as well as the Honors College. The leadership course that you've come and [00:25:00] visited before, I'm teaching that with the, um, the dean for the health.

[00:25:04] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: community and policy college, Lynn Kosman. Um, and I can just go on and on. So it's really about taking the students who want to do more with their UTSA degree. Um, and those are colleges from all colleges and those are the students that we serve. So there's not really competition with respect to that.

[00:25:23] Bob Rivard: Well, when you talk about Establishing a goal of building the Honors College student body up to 10%. And I think UTSA is, what, 30, 000 plus at this point? 

[00:25:33] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Correct. 

[00:25:34] Bob Rivard: Total. Is that a matter of dollars and cents that you have for scholarships and all these programs? Or what keeps you from getting, say, from 2, 600 to say, well, let's add 400 more?

[00:25:45] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Right now, it's getting the story out about the Honors College. I can Do more for more students if we have more scholarship dollars so we can have even more students to the Archer Fellowship if we can have more scholarship [00:26:00] dollars. And so that to me is really where development comes in. I can continue to deliver more and better through our team and with our students if there's more development funds.

[00:26:11] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: That's the way to think about it. 

[00:26:13] Bob Rivard: So we mentioned Harvey Najem and obviously, um, the major philanthropists in the city, uh, when they make a major gift that generates headlines. But the fact is people of much more modest means can, uh, successful leaders in the community can, can contribute. And, um, what is the, the base for establishing an endowed scholarship these days?

[00:26:35] Bob Rivard: It's 

[00:26:35] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: 25, 000 and it doesn't have to be from a single person. It could be, it could be somebody, it could be 10 different individuals, 100 different individuals that want to set that up. And what's important about, about those is each one, you can target where you want those to go. So you could look at our whole portfolio of experiential learning and say, I want it to go to internships.

[00:26:56] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: For example, we have a summer program right now. where [00:27:00] we provide scholarships for students who are in un or underfunded research assistantships and internships because we know again we don't want them to have lost wages. Right now I would love to grow that five, ten times the size and that's something that we could do for scholarship dollars if those endowments wanted to be targeted toward those.

[00:27:18] Bob Rivard: If somebody was considering establishing one of those, Jill, what would you tell them is the return on investment there? What, what are they accomplishing by establishing a 25, 000 scholarship? They might think that's not going to do anything. 

[00:27:31] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: I think if you talk to students, including Brandon and Vicki, every single dollar counts.

[00:27:36] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And the more that we can, as the Honors College, provide Courses. In fact, even our funding, um, the funding in the Honors College also supports the experiential learning. And I'd love to talk about a couple of our courses that are amazing. Um, and we pay for all of those costs. So students don't have to pay for the additional costs that can sometimes give 

[00:27:54] Bob Rivard: us some examples.

[00:27:56] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Um, Oh, I have so many. So one that [00:28:00] is truly transformative for our students is taught by Dr. Mel Webb, and it's a partnership between the College of Liberal and Fine Arts and the Honors College, and Dr. Webb takes UTSA students interested in Uh, philosophies and literature surrounding justice and our carceral system and takes them to Domingo State Jail and they go inside the jail and learn alongside in a peer education model with incarcerated scholars.

[00:28:28] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So they're writing and they're reading. poetry and essays about what justice is and what justice looks like and the personal histories of those. That's one course, but that 

[00:28:38] Bob Rivard: what's an incarcerated scholar, please. 

[00:28:40] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So it's somebody who is incarcerated, who has the very intentional commitment to being in a classroom setting and learning.

[00:28:49] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Another example is we have a Sustainable Living and Intentional Living program that starts with about a week and a half in Costa Rica off the grid where students are [00:29:00] learning are in a sustainability course for farming and agriculture. animal husbandry as well. And they also have to do yoga in the rainforest at least once a day.

[00:29:09] Bob Rivard: Who wouldn't sign up for that? 

[00:29:11] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Well, you live in a bunkhouse, um, without screens. Um, it's, it's not, it's, it is lovely, but it is, it is not a hotel situation or spring break situation. Um, and then the students come back and apply those principles in San Antonio to see how San Antonio is also trying to do, uh, work around sustainable urban living.

[00:29:31] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And so, We cover all of the costs except 500, so that includes Plainfair, much what Vicki was talking about, um, Plainfair, all of the curriculum, all of the lodging and the meals, and then we also have an experiential learning award that students can apply for, for 500. So a student could go, um, and it's intentionally short so students who work and who are caregiving can find the time to be able to go.

[00:29:54] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So those are just two examples of our courses. I have many more that I could talk about. 

[00:29:58] Bob Rivard: Well. I, [00:30:00] I find that you guys are bringing a very creative approach to to learning and redefining what the classroom is. I've been out there with other community leaders like a former Bear County Judge Nelson Wolf to talk to students and they're obviously getting great travel opportunities.

[00:30:17] Bob Rivard: Tell, tell our audience a little bit about something that you and I have cooked up where we hope. by the end of the semester to have some student co hosts here. 

[00:30:26] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Absolutely. So the, the backstory to know is that when you have these, I talked about these six experiences that students have to do in the Honors College in order to graduate from the Honors College.

[00:30:36] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: You can do those in the courses. Like I explained, you can do them individually. You can create your own, or you can do them in small groups. And Brandon described one with the honors and agent strategist, but there's another kind called a guided experience. And what we do here is we take a problem or an issue or an opportunity in the community and we up, up skill and up train students to be able to address [00:31:00] that problem or that issue.

[00:31:02] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: However, there are times like this one when, when I have somebody like Barbara Bard say, Hey, you know, it might be really interesting to have some student co hosts. And so the Associate Dean for Academic Affairs and I sit down and say, now what would that look like? How could students build out experiential learning that has academic rigor with application and reflection and does something good for the community?

[00:31:24] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And so our students are working with our Uh, one of our vice presidents of communication at UTSA to understand the production of podcasts to be able to learn how to pitch a story and then they're going to pitch you the story and then you get to choose which ones you want to co host. 

[00:31:40] Bob Rivard: And are they identifying potential interview targets?

[00:31:44] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Absolutely. They're doing the whole, they're running the whole gamut and, and we're really what it is, is a journalism and communications course that's happening outside of a standard student credit hour model. And so they're still getting a coursework, course worth of experience, [00:32:00] um, and content and application, but they're doing it without having to, um, enroll in a course.

[00:32:06] Bob Rivard: Well, we look forward to hearing more about that as the semester progresses. I think in April, we're going to be focused on the mayor's race here. There's only 27 people on the ballot. Just 

[00:32:15] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: that. 

[00:32:15] Bob Rivard: And, um, but come maybe early May, 

[00:32:19] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: we'll, 

[00:32:19] Bob Rivard: we'll be able to, uh, circle back and see how we, how that program, how that progress and whether or not it resulted in something that we can put on air.

[00:32:28] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: It'd be very exciting to see. 

[00:32:30] Brandon Aviado: Bob, why don't I go back to one of the previous points you made before we get too far off? 

[00:32:33] Bob Rivard: Absolutely. 

[00:32:33] Brandon Aviado: You, you talked about how 25, 000, how that might not seem like it's a lot. Um, but I, I'd like to contextualize a little bit that, of, of the student experience. Um, a lot of the guys that I've talked to, I mean, we talk about maybe, you know, 1, 000 distributed across them, that would be a huge deal.

[00:32:50] Brandon Aviado: Um, 1, 000 over 4 years, that's, you know, 4, 000, that's 6 students. Doesn't sound like a lot, but some of the students that I've hung out with, that I've talked to, that I work with, [00:33:00] Um, that's the difference between rent, being closer to school versus driving an hour from Floresville to go to class. Uh, that's one way, right?

[00:33:06] Brandon Aviado: I mean, two ways, that's two hours every day. Uh, that's the difference between them having to work at Walmart for a job versus being able to get the opportunity to do an internship. And I really wanted to solidify that because I have friends that have to make that decision. Um, especially when we talk about young men, young Latino men here in San Antonio.

[00:33:22] Brandon Aviado: Um, there's already a cultural issue where, you know, it's believed that if you're taking money to go to college, you're doing something wrong. Um, if you're not working and you're not providing to the family, then you as a young man, a young Latino man here in San Antonio, you're doing something wrong. And so that that small difference of of scholarship can be the difference between them even going to college and not going to college.

[00:33:41] Brandon Aviado: So I really just wanted to harp on that point a bit from. Some of the experiences I've had or my friends have had at UTSI. 

[00:33:48] Bob Rivard: No, I think that's a really important point and convincing families that don't have a college graduate yet, uh, that, that, uh, schools and investment and not an expense is, uh, is a [00:34:00] hurdle that we all have to work on to, to, to continue doing that.

[00:34:04] Bob Rivard: Let me ask the two of you, you, you, I assume you both own automobiles. Uh, because we're a car centric city and, um, you both live off campus? Yes. 

[00:34:13] Victoria Kidder: Yeah. 

[00:34:13] Bob Rivard: Okay. Close to campus or far? 

[00:34:15] Brandon Aviado: I'm about 15 minutes away. 

[00:34:17] Victoria Kidder: I live pretty close to campus. Okay. How 

[00:34:19] Bob Rivard: do you, um, finance your, your living expenses? Uh, automobile, gas, uh, rent, utilities, uh, spending money, groceries.

[00:34:31] Victoria Kidder: Um, luckily my dad is able to help finance that on top of, you know, the scholarship that I already get. Um, and I usually. Do work a job. So those three things together help to finance. But the apartment's close to campus. UTSA has a shuttle service. So instead of having to drive back and forth to every class, you know, pay for gas, find parking.

[00:34:55] Victoria Kidder: I just hop on the shuttle and then, you know, I'm right on campus. [00:35:00] 

[00:35:00] Brandon Aviado: For me, my, uh, my wife is active duty military, so, um, she's the primary breadwinner of the house. But I, I've worked probably every semester that I've been in college. Um, that's why I was very thankful to have these internships that also are paying, but also count for college credit, um, because I don't have the luxury of just like pausing my college journey, and I don't have the luxury of not working during it.

[00:35:19] Brandon Aviado: Um, I have two children, so I have to pay for not just How old are your kids? I got an 11 year old daughter and an 11 month old son. 

[00:35:26] Bob Rivard: I think, um, you actually fit the profile of a lot of students that are at the Alamo colleges and the public universities here, which are, you know, married, children. Uh, having to work and I understand both of you have said you have done or are doing, uh, you're, you're working for outside internships.

[00:35:45] Bob Rivard: In other words, paying what, what kind of work are you doing? 

[00:35:48] Brandon Aviado: So for the Yahoo, I'm helping do, um, products. I guess management. So we're doing, you know, revenue modeling. Um, we're doing the, yes, I'm being [00:36:00] paid for it. Uh, and then I'm also doing research and then, and kind of, uh, project management for the end of other internship.

[00:36:05] Brandon Aviado: Um, is 

[00:36:05] Bob Rivard: that like an hourly wage? 

[00:36:07] Brandon Aviado: Uh, yes. So I get about 25 an hour Yahoo. Oh, that's pretty good. So a big step up from what I was doing before and then 15 an hour with, uh, it's Pathfinder insurance that I'm doing the other internship with 

[00:36:17] Bob Rivard: Vicky. 

[00:36:18] Victoria Kidder: So, last semester, the Honors College actually created a job for me and some other students who did the Archer Fellowship program.

[00:36:25] Victoria Kidder: So, the application for the Archer Fellowship is a personal statement, a policy paper, and then a list and justification of internships that you want to apply to. And, you know, a lot of students apply because they're interested in going to D. C. and getting that experiential learning. So, the Honors College hired me to review people's applications, provide advice, meet with people one on one, and tell them about the program.

[00:36:49] Victoria Kidder: Um, so that's about 15 an hour, and it's really flexible. So, you know, I can take my classes, focus on studying for the LSAT and getting into law school, and, you know, earn money. [00:37:00] 

[00:37:00] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: If I can add to that, that, that's a really good example of how We are exceedingly student, student forward. We were thinking about how can we build the recruitment for the Archer Fellowship.

[00:37:10] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And the person who runs it, Christy Meyer, said, well, what we should do is have students talk to students. So let's create an Archer Ambassadorship Program, um, and incentivize students for it as well because they should be incentivized and paid for the work that they're doing. And that's how that program was born.

[00:37:27] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And Vicki was one of our first Archer Ambassadors. 

[00:37:29] Bob Rivard: All right. Jill, when I attended UTSA, it was very much a commuter school and, um, probably 97 percent of the students were, if not from, uh, Bexar County and the surrounding counties from South Texas. But, uh, now we encounter, um, students like, uh, Vicki and Brandon who are from out of state.

[00:37:50] Bob Rivard: And in fact, um, there's no shortage of students that are from out of country. And I wonder, um, do you track at all how many of those students end up [00:38:00] being brain gained for San Antonio upon graduation and stay in the city or if not in the city, in the region 

[00:38:06] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: in development? So we have some indirect measures of it.

[00:38:10] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: We don't, um, we are working on. More direct measures. For example, I just looked at since 2019 how many UTSA honor students have graduated from UT Health Science Center. Um, and that's that's for another presentation. And there were 140 and I think about 

[00:38:29] Bob Rivard: These are students that went on to medical school, dental school, PhD 

[00:38:32] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: and OT, and most often where you train for your health sciences profession is where you stay.

[00:38:38] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: So that's, that's, as I mentioned, that's an indirect measure, but I, what I do know is that the more students do internships in a city, and this is just national data, the more they do sustained service learning in the city. Far more likely they are to stay in the city. Um, one of the other things we have done and, and part of our intentional community in the Honors college is that students have to do, [00:39:00] attend three events per semester to get priority for our funding.

[00:39:03] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And we created an honors in the city event, um, because we also knew that it's not only working in the city, but it's playing and living in the city. And so, um, we, again, we fund all of these, uh, we take a group of 50 students, and this is through somebody's generous donation to their ballet. Each semester and they meet with the ballet dancers afterward as well as a choreographer so they're getting the full, the full gamut, um, they volunteer for the Fiesta Arts Fair and then they go to the Fiesta Arts Fair, San Antonio Botanical Gardens, we've gone to some sports games as well.

[00:39:36] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: And so what we're really focused on is how do we create engagement, experiential learning opportunities that fulfill both the academic and the professional, but also the social because we want students to extend and see San Antonio as their place to live and to play, um, and to get back. 

[00:39:54] Bob Rivard: That's wonderful.

[00:39:55] Bob Rivard: Um, not to put you two on the spot, but is San Antonio in your future? [00:40:00] Um, Brandon, we'll start with you and you may end up going wherever your wife is deployed, I assume. 

[00:40:04] Brandon Aviado: Yeah, I, well, she's thinking that maybe this is the last, um, last duty station. Uh, at San Antonio is somewhere we've grown to love. Uh, I will say, especially after being a part of Alamo colleges and getting really involved in the community.

[00:40:16] Brandon Aviado: Um, I do really like San Antonio, but having an 11 month old baby, uh, home is kind of calling to us as well. So it depends. Uh, we'll see where things end up and how the housing market also is in Seattle after this, so. How 

[00:40:29] Bob Rivard: much more school do you have to do here? 

[00:40:30] Brandon Aviado: I'll graduate next spring, so not this year, but the following.

[00:40:34] Bob Rivard: So you have another, you're, you're on the cusp of graduation and of course, you're going to take your gap year and so you may, you may be traveling far and wide, but um, do you anticipate going back to Maryland? Vicki, or is San Antonio your new home or, or who knows where, where you'll end up? 

[00:40:52] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, right now it's a kind of who knows, everything's up in the air.

[00:40:55] Victoria Kidder: Um, I'm definitely going to apply for law school at St. Mary's. Um, I [00:41:00] think a lot of politics and law, political science majors at UTSA who are interested in law school definitely apply to St. Mary's. 

[00:41:07] Bob Rivard: Now that you can explain the state budget to all of us, it seems to me you're deeply invested in Texas after your time in Austin.

[00:41:15] Victoria Kidder: Yeah, I mean, I love Texas. My boyfriend's a firefighter and he lives up in Brown Rock, so, you know, might move there, might. You know, do Fulbright in Vietnam, but yeah, right now everything's up in the air, but I'm definitely not opposed to coming back and settling down in San Antonio. 

[00:41:31] Bob Rivard: We can help him with firefighting here in San Antonio.

[00:41:34] Bob Rivard: We have a big firefighting department and he could move here. Well, we're running out of time, but it's been great to visit with both of you and Jill. Thank you so much for bringing a couple of Honors College students with us because it just, there's just so much energy to seeing young people that are doing wonderful things and On their own career paths with so much ahead of you, 

[00:41:54] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: they give me so much hope every day.

[00:41:56] Bob Rivard: Well, thank you all three for coming on to big city, small town. 

[00:41:59] Jill Fleuriet, Ph.D.: Thank you. [00:42:00] Yeah, appreciate it.

[00:42:04] Bob Rivard: Please share this episode with friends and colleagues and do sign up for our new newsletter, Monday Musings. Big City Small Town is brought to you by Western Urban, building the city our children want to call home. And Geekdom, where startups are born and smart ideas become businesses. Our producer is Corey Ames.

[00:42:22] Bob Rivard: Video by Erica Rempel. Sound engineering by Alfie de la Garza of Sound Crane Audio. We will see you next week.